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189

Zelensky-Starmer latest: Starmer unveils steps to help Ukraine after summit with European leaders (www.bbc.co.uk)

submitted 14 hours ago by LanaDelRey242@lemmy.world to c/world@lemmy.world

22 comments fedilink hide all child comments

Following a meeting with world leaders, Starmer has announced a £1.6bn financing package to Ukraine, the creation of a "Coalition of the Willing", and that a deal to be presented to Trump. He has emphasised:

The importance of the US's participation in the coalition
His trust in the US as an ongoing ally to Europe
His confidence that a deal will be reached

top 22 comments

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[–] aaron@infosec.pub 31 points 13 hours ago* (last edited 13 hours ago) (1 children)

Here are the four points the bbc is reporting, which are completely different to yours. https://www.bbc.com/news/live/cn5220x56pqt

To keep military aid flowing into Ukraine while the war is ongoing, and increase economic pressure on Russia
Any lasting peace must ensure Ukraine's sovereignty and security, and Ukraine must be at the table for any peace talks
In the event of a peace deal, European leaders will aim to deter any future invasion by Russia into Ukraine
There would be a "coalition of the willing" to defend Ukraine and guarantee peace in the country

[–] LanaDelRey242@lemmy.world -4 points 13 hours ago (2 children)

Thank you for posting these and yes absolutely, this is the overarching four-point strategy that he outlined.

I was summarising the points specifically with respect his comments on Trump and the USA's involvement, perhaps I should have made that clear.

[–] JacksonLamb@lemmy.world 3 points 2 hours ago

Yes, you should have. Several people in here seem to be reacting to the mistaken idea that Europe's only focus is Trump.

[–] FarceOfWill@infosec.pub 11 points 11 hours ago

It's a very odd way to frame it.

This is almost entirely a European plan.

[–] shoulderoforion@fedia.io 21 points 14 hours ago (3 children)

I mean this doesn't sound like any forward movement at all, this sounds like nothing. This sounds like a plan predicated on Trump becoming a completely different person overnight, and brokering a deal with Russia that can be trusted, laugh with me

[–] LanaDelRey242@lemmy.world 9 points 13 hours ago (2 children)

I think there is a lot more to it than what is being presented. We're getting the "carrot" version of things, there will almost certainly be a "stick" that will be presented, and Starmer will outline the grave consequences of the USA not cooperating.

It was interesting that Starmer seemed so confident that Trump would agree. This means either he's hugely bluffing to put on a show, or the nice guy show to Trump is over and they can get him to bend by force.

[–] cyd@lemmy.world 1 points 6 hours ago (1 children)

What plausible stick could the UK (with or without EU) wield against the US? Pull out of NATO or the Five Eyes? That would hurt them way more than it would hurt the US, and Trump knows they're too rational to let it happen.

[–] kablammy@sh.itjust.works 3 points 4 hours ago

Re Five Eyes, they should stop helping the USA on that front immediately, as any info given to them will be used to crush internal dissent.

[–] shoulderoforion@fedia.io 11 points 13 hours ago (2 children)

with so many foreign troops fighting for russia in ukraine, there is zero justification for european troops not to be fighting with the ukranians as well. zero. every day that uk & france aren't mobilzing and deploying troops to ukraine is just more european stalling until complete abandonment

[–] LanaDelRey242@lemmy.world 1 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

They're preparing for deployment asap pretty much

[–] shoulderoforion@fedia.io 2 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

no. they really really really aren't.

[–] LanaDelRey242@lemmy.world 1 points 12 hours ago

What makes you think that?

[–] popsyking 1 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

That would be risky. Could easily trigger a world war.

[–] shoulderoforion@fedia.io 5 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

sure could, but if russia is using foreign troops to fight and kill european ukranians it already is by definition

[–] popsyking -1 points 12 hours ago (2 children)

Well yes but it's a bit different if you have north Koreans Vs Ukrainians or a world war where Russia moves into Poland and China into Taiwan.

[–] xmunk@sh.itjust.works 5 points 12 hours ago

It's really only different for two reasons:

That side already has access to nukes.
Russian propaganda.

France and the UK could absolutely dedicate expeditionary forces.

[–] Zaktor@sopuli.xyz 1 points 8 hours ago

Russia isn't in any way a threat to expand their invasion. If they could simultaneously invade Poland they wouldn't be struggling so hard to reclaim their own territory, let alone conquer Ukraine. China is the one powerful and expansive enough to worry about.

[–] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 7 points 13 hours ago

I mean he just casually pledged 1.6 billion so that's not nothing. The only plan there was ever going to be was what Europe was already doing, only more of it.

[–] Voroxpete@sh.itjust.works 1 points 14 hours ago

Starmer is a centrist moron. This is exactly the sort of shit we expect from him.

[–] A_A@lemmy.world 8 points 14 hours ago* (last edited 12 hours ago) (1 children)

i hope this is just one step in a strategy beginning by telling Trump he is not one in the "Coalition Of The Willing" anymore.
Things may escalate rapidly after ~~staying~~ stating Europe's position.

[–] LanaDelRey242@lemmy.world 8 points 13 hours ago (1 children)

I suspect it will be, "here is our final offer, get on board or face the consequences". I do wonder whether Europe and Canada are going to try and apply any sort of leverage over Trump or whether they have already accepted that they will have to go it alone. If the latter happens I predict a full on meltdown from Trump that will make his Zelenskyy interaction look sane.

[–] d00phy@lemmy.world 3 points 9 hours ago

I think of you offer anything that even smells like an ultimatum, Trump’s going to respond with tariffs. For some reason, he’s behaving like a rabid dog backed into a corner, and he’s lashing out at any and every perceived threat.

Rather, I think Europe should intend on proceeding without the US. Trump said it himself, “We’re out.” Take him at his word, and act accordingly. He will either see the light, or he won’t.

European countries can attempt to continue relations with the US, separate from Ukraine, unless Trump wants to make it about Ukraine. If he does, it should be explained that Ukraine’s not on the table, the US has stated their position (they’re out), and Europe is respecting that.