this post was submitted on 23 Feb 2025
96 points (92.9% liked)
Linux Gaming
16392 readers
678 users here now
Discussions and news about gaming on the GNU/Linux family of operating systems (including the Steam Deck). Potentially a $HOME away from home for disgruntled /r/linux_gaming denizens of the redditarian demesne.
This page can be subscribed to via RSS.
Original /r/linux_gaming pengwing by uoou.
Resources
WWW:
Discord:
IRC:
Matrix:
Telegram:
founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Get VR working without having to compile from source and it will be
It would be nice but according to Steam only 1.9% of users have VR headsets. So it's naturally a slow development.
I played through HL Alyx on a baremetal PopOS! system and Valve Index, with no need to compile a kernel from source ... in 2022.
VR is not mainstream gaming.
VR is a minority of a minority of a minority of gaming.
Steam VR mostly works. It's one of the areas that takes a massive stinky performance hit, and there is no motion smoothing yet (somehow), but it does work. I've put thousands of hours into vrchat in it, played through all of Alyx, etc. all on Linux.
In addition to what others have said... It is?
I can plug in my index, open steam, and run VR games, just fine.
My HP Reverb G2 V2 isn't.
it doesn't work on windows anymore either
Then I'm really confused about how I was playing Beat Saber on my Windows partition last night.
Also, I'm not sure "it doesn't work on Windows" is the standard the Linux community should be trying to live up to. My old laptop doesn't work on Windows 10 or 11, but it runs modern Linux just fine.
Unless you're just playing dumb, you should be aware that it has been removed from Windows 11. You can hold back the update for now at least (or stay on Windows 10).
Anyway Monado is coming along nicely, but unless Valve and the other companies they are involved in it start throwing more devs at it, there's not much more that can be done.
I am aware of that. It was part of my decision to move to Linux (and to keep my Windows 10 partition).
That doesn't change the fact that it also doesn't work on Linux, which was the point of my original comment.
I look forward to Monado progressing, but in the meantime Linux is not a solution for gamers who care about VR and own a WMR headset.
What's your point?
That microsoft didn't enable the necessary software components to run windows mixed reality HMDs on linux?
The reverbs never natively supported any open standards like SteamVR or OpenXR.
WMR headsets are the ones that have been the hardest to get going with open VR systems like Monado, but that doesn't mean that hardware that implemented sane standards isn't already working great, which it is.
That said, WMR is partially working at this time.
Bottom line, if you use something that is actually supposed to work, it does. If you don't, then yeah, the volunteer-created hacks to get things to work are still in progress.
"Get VR working and it will be."
"It is!"
"No, it is for your specific hardware and use case."
No - that's a given. It's that nobody has working third party software for my hardware yet, hence the "VR isn't ready on Linux yet" statement.
I know.
I know.
I know.
I know.
My VR hardware is still not working, and Linux is clearly not "VR ready".
By that logic android doesn't work because you can't use it on a iPhone.
Android doesn't pride itself on its incredible hardware compatibility to the same extent that Linux does.
I realize that I am in no way entitled to other people's labor to get WMR working on Linux, of course, but until this significant category of VR headsets does work on Linux, it is not VR ready.
And that justifies the double standard?
Who decided this is where the goalpost is, except for you?
It absolutely does. A huge part of Linux's whole schtick is that open and community-sourced software is more compatible and just plain better than proprietary offerings. Linux is better, and it can handle being held to a higher standard.
Yeah, uh, that's kinda how opinions work. There is no objective measurement of what "VR readiness" means - it's going to be an arbitrary division no matter who is deciding where the line is. I just think that arbitrary division should include the set of headsets that just a few years ago constituted at least 10% of the market as measured by Steam alone, if not significantly higher once other proprietary storefronts that these headsets were aimed at are included.
Then you're going to have to acknowledge that your opinion disagrees with most others.
And that a lot of people are going to consider accounting for what a piece of software "prides itself in" when defining what kind of standards need to be met for features to be considered "ready", to be pretty weird.
VR works on linux. That is indisputable. The majority of people have VR hardware that works on linux. That is indisputable.
Linux is more than ready for gaming, but by your standards, it isn't ready for that either because some games use a level of anti-cheat so invasive, it will never work.
These games are "significant" in the same way WMR hardware is, if not moreso.
Says who? You? On the contrary, I think you're going to have to acknowledge that your opinion disagrees with most others.
And a lot of people won't feel that way, especially because "work being done until certain standards are met to be considered 'ready'" is literally how software development works, including on Linux.
You've been really good at shoving your words down my throat throughout this conversation, but I'll humor you yet again.
This is a completely different situation because the devs are actively preventing the software from working on Linux.
WMR can work on Linux - it just doesn't yet, because the third party software tools to enable it to do so haven't been finished yet. WMR isn't being actively blocked from working on Linux the same way the antagonistic game devs are doing so for the kernel-level anticheat games.
No, actually you'll find that it's quite disputable, especially since that's exactly what I'm doing. I'm disputing it. Right now. This is me disputing it. *waves*
Thus, not indisputable. QED.
As in the software. No part of a linux OS prevents the necessary components, game engines, graphics drivers, etc, from functioning. It runs. You cannot claim otherwise without specifying an adverse environment.
If you're genuinely trying to convince me that your logic makes sense, please start by justifying double standards, keeping in mind that any genuinely excusable double standard, is by definition, not a double standard.
I'd rather you didn't, I tuned out when you acknowledged you're presenting a personal opinion, rather than a generally perceivable consensus.
I am sorry that the peripheral specifics of analogies confuse you, but please be aware that attacking them instead of the point itself, does not invalidate the logic that makes it applicable in illustrating a point.
If requiring every conceivable mode of operation to work, is not always required, then it cannot be arbitrarily sometimes required, "because you say so".
You will not find majority agreement on this.
Then your entire comment chain has been completely (and seemingly intentionally) irrelevant to the point I was making in the first place. In hindsight I suppose that makes sense, since you've been building strawmen and tilting at windmills this entire conversation. Literally nobody has said that the games specifically don't work once the hardware has been made compatible (through software, I should note). Either way, thanks for wasting both of our time.
And yet here you still are, intentionally misunderstanding the conversation by your own admission, and, once again, wasting everyone's time in order to white knight for Linux and act like it's flawless and that everything in the world works when a) that's objectively not true and b) Linux has no need of this sort of ridiculous white knighting in the first place.
Considering you're fighting this argument on three+ fronts, I don't think you can lay the blame of deciding to waste time, on me.
I can't help you see the point of an analogy, if you insist on fixating on the irrelevant parts you can inconsequentially dismantle while willfully ignoring the actual point.
I'm sorry it took me so long to say it plain, I guess.
Counter point: VR is working. It's not working for your specific hardware and use case.
My Oculus Dev Kit 1 and 2 don't work properly on Windows anymore. Does that mean Windows isn't ready for gaming because my specific VR hardware doesn't work on it? Or does it mean that "VR ready" doesn't have to include every VR headset.
Counter-counter point: some VR is working. It's not working for a significant portion of VR hardware, so it is not VR ready.
Windows isn't ready for much of anything these days, so I'm not really sure why you're trying to make that comparison with Linux, an OS that prides itself on openness and getting an insane variety of hardware working on it.
I agree that "VR ready" doesn't have to include every single headset, but that's pretty disingenuous when a significant number of VR headsets use(d) WMR. Linux will not be VR ready until WMR is working.
The number of different branded headsets using WMR doesn't make it significant in any way. Based on Steam hardware survey, WMR headsets only account for 2.84% of VR headsets. Index, Quest 2, Quest 3 account for ~70% of VR headsets in use, and they all work on Linux. Index just naturally in SteamVR and it's my understanding that setting up ALVR for the quest ones isn't that tricky (but I've also never tried). And much of the remaining 30% other headsets work with ALVR too.
And the point of comparing things to Windows, is that if we're stating "Linux isn't ready for gaming because not every VR headset works", then by that definition Windows isn't either. Which you probably agree with, but generally speaking "people" / society view Windows as ready for gaming despite it not supporting every headset.
It's basically getting into the "Fortnite doesn't work on Linux" type of situation now. Some things are just never going to work, and it's because of the creator of those things and not Linux itself, and who cares. Even if the things that don't work are popular, that doesn't mean that on the whole, the OS isn't ready.
Also, according to steam only 1.9% of accounts have a VR headset. That alone makes VR an edge case. but 2.84% of 1.9% is 0.05% of overall steam accounts using WMR. I think Linux can be ready for gaming without WMR support.
That's kind of a disingenuous citation, since WMR has been officially discontinued by Windows for over a year, and you can't install it on any new machines, so of course its official use numbers are currently incredibly low.
Five years ago, however, WMR was more than 10% of the VR market (and that's not even including all of the other proprietary storefronts that these headsets were aimed at), and I'd bet that a lot of people, like me, would still use it if it were better supported. Plus that's a lot of e-waste that could be reused and repurposed if we could get 3rd party software to work.
Literally the only reason I still dual-boot my gaming PC is because I have to boot into window$ any time I want to use my VR headset, so, while I would absolutely love it if Linux were VR ready, that's unfortunately just not the case.
Got it. Linux is not VR ready until it supports discontinued headsets. that were previously at 10% of the 2% market, but are now even less (because it's discontinued, and thus only going to continue to shrink).
That is correct (your pejorative framing of the situation notwithstanding).
Okay here's what I'm going to posit to you: If you truly care about e-waste, then your stance here is a disservice to that goal. This year, Win10 reaches the end of its service life, and millions upon millions of computers will become "e-waste" unless a switch to Linux is made. This includes countless gaming rigs. Nothing is ever going to reach 100% compatibility, and to argue it should is disingenuous. Right now we need to be working on convincing people that for the vast majority of use cases, Linux is VR-ready, and more broadly gaming ready. Doing so will also help the development of those minority use cases as the overall platform gains momentum.
I do understand that it isn't VR-ready for you but I don't think it's fair to generalise that to everyone else.
I can absolutely generalize that to the literal thousands of other people who might suddenly be faced with the fact that Linux is not VR ready when they decide to switch based on incomplete, intentionally misleading information to try to sell Linux as something that it's not.
They have a right to an informed decision too, and I don't think "just lie to them for the greater good lol" is the correct answer here.
Not to mention, "Linux is gaming-ready, as long as you don't need 100% VR headset compatibility" still has the capability to draw in a ton of new people.
From what I've seen, almost all advice about making the switch to Linux is along the lines of "try it out" or "dual-boot Windows" so I fail to see how anyone is going to be seriously inconvenienced here.
As well, marketing in general is full of embellishments to the truth. Microsoft lies, Google lies, Apple lies. To turn around and say that Linux isn't ready for gaming when (using your charitable 10% figure) 0.2% of gamers won't be able to use it, is ridiculous.
You got lied too by Microsoft on the promise of hardware support and they pulled the plug. It feels like now you're trying to lay the blame at Linux' feet instead of copping that on the chin.
This seems like even more of a reason to be up front about it then, and add "not all VR headsets work" to the list of caveats for people switching along with "you might not be able to play your favorite predatory multiplayer game".
Yes, Micro$oft is a shitty company that lied to and shafted its customers, which is why it seems really odd to me to argue that Linux should be doing the same thing instead of being better. And by better, I don't mean they have an obligation to support my headset or anything - just that we should be honest about the fact that Linux doesn't instead of falsely acting like it does with misleading blanket statements like "VR works on Linux" when that's just not true.
We're just circling back to the fact that WMR is a tiny subset though. You're holding Linux to an impossible standard that you aren't holding the maker of your headset (API) too.
You've talked about Linux as if it should meet these lofty goals, but what you're failing to recognise is that Microsoft pays teams of hundreds to thousands of developers, and Linux is completely free and donation/grant-based. So of course it isn't going to be perfect, and of course it isn't going to support every little niche.
Your concept that because of its open nature it should support everything from the history of gaming and computing is an unreasonable expectation. Old laptops work well so people who wouldn't otherwise have access to a computer can get something working for very little money, and because those devices are prolific. But even then almost all distros have deprecated 32-bit support.
What? I am absolutely holding Microsoft to that standard - I quit using their operating system and switched to Linux, for god's sake. If I could use Linux for VR and delete my M$ partition, I'd do it literally right now. But I can't, because Linux doesn't support it.
And, once again, the conversation is literally about VR here - it's completely disingenuous to claim that a platform that at least 10% the market runs on is "a tiny subset".
Wow, you're right! That's never once occurred to me. Wow, what a revelation that I totally failed to recognize after over a year of running Linux on every computer in my household up until this moment on the Linux gaming community. Thank goodness a brilliant individual like you could finally break through my ignorance and make me aware of this little-known fact.
Jesus.
Please quote where I said that. Like, a literal, actual quote.
I've really had it with people in this thread shoving their words down my throat. Like, it's really getting old.
Here's what I said (again). Everyone reading this thread, please pay attention and actually READ this time:
"Linux has no obligation to support my headset. They don't have an obligation to support VR at all! However, when the question on the table is 'is Linux gaming ready', the answer should be 'yes, but', and one of the (quickly shrinking number of) buts that must be included is that Linux is not fully VR ready"
Is it true that Microsoft is also not fully VR ready, and that they don't even support the VR platform they themselves suckered thousands of people into? YES!!
Is Microsoft also not gaming ready, since you seem so hung up on what Microsoft does? Absolutely, and in many ways they're even less gaming ready than Linux is, imo.
But, you know who does at the very least tell people that they don't support WMR?
Microsoft.
With how long VR has been around, I can still count on one hand the number of people I know that have an entry level Quest, let alone good VR gear. For that reason, I dunno if I'd include VR in the definition of mainstream.
Its not mainstream. probably never be mainstream... Just like 3d TVs.
Its a rich mans hobby.
the only reason the quest is "cheap" in comparison is because its facebook and when it comes to facebook.. you will always be the product. Its sold to you "cheap" compared to others, because they make that back and more on harvesting and selling the data they collect from you using it.
overwhelming majority of gamers use gaming to escape and relax. Jumping around a room exhausting yourself is kind of the antithesis to that.
I'm not sure what games you're playing, but most are what would be considered light to moderate exercise (unless you're playing fitness focused games at a high level), hardly something that is going to exhaust yourself. I'll add that many VR games are standing or sitting experiences (or are room scale but require nothing more than walking).
Nevertheless, there are barriers like the weight and heat of the headsets (and the price) so I don't disagree that it's not mainstream.
A coworker said he watches movies and stuff more than playing games, partly because of this. He was clear that he has VR games, but the required physical movement is sometimes not what he wants, and there's the issue of lag-induced motion sickness besides.
Yep
There are people that want to interact with the movie, like those rocky horror special showings.
but the vast majority of people just want to sit back, relax, and enjoy.
Which is half the reason why VR will be a minority of gaming, and not mainstream. the other half, of course, being the insane costs.
If you package it, they will come
A lot of people use Quest standalone, but the PC VR experience is much, much better if it can be setup right. Eliminating the major issues that hold it back from working would make a big difference.
That and a whole smorgasboard of Windows MR headsets will be useless bargain bin items soon, as Microsoft is pulling support for those headsets entirely, and I know the linux community has added support for Windows MR in Linux. They're not bad headsets, and being super cheap would let a lot of people try out VR, even if the experience is a bit behind compared to the modern headsets (Index, Quest 3, etc.)
I know what you're saying, and i kinda agree, but even including Windows, the share of VR users is still small, and that's making use of drivers that generally work ootb. VR just isn't as popular (yet?).
I didn't know about Microsoft pulling away from MR. I would love to have a MR headset, so I'll have to keep an eye out. Thanks!
About two years ago, Microsoft axed the entire MR devteam, and a few months back announced they will remove MR entirely in a future update to Windows.
I once had a Samsung Odyssey (not the +), and while the Quest 2 has a better screen resolution and much better controller tracking (and the 3 improves on both again), the Samsung's OLED displays have way better contrast ratios, which makes it much better when running games that have dark scenes.
I recently switched my VR PC from Windows to Bazzite. No compiling necessary.
Unless your using something like a Pimax its there. Have a look at Envision. You can install it from the AUR or a appimage from git both allow you to avoid having to compile from source. Envision allows you to use Monado if you have a wired headset or WiVRn if you have a quest or other wireless headset and can also install WlxOverlay or Stardust as overlays.
This page has whats compatible with what headsets https://lvra.gitlab.io/docs/hardware/