this post was submitted on 27 Jul 2025
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[–] caboose2006@lemmy.world 32 points 6 days ago (2 children)

US Train travel has actually gotten worse since 1996.

[–] FosterMolasses@leminal.space 7 points 6 days ago

Came to say this. If it had literally remained unchanged they'd still be doing pretty good.

[–] JcbAzPx@lemmy.world 10 points 6 days ago

Yeah, the only reason we still have tracks most places is for freight.

[–] Aceticon@lemmy.dbzer0.com 20 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago) (13 children)

In Capitalist nations, the further we are from the era of peak Unions and in general civil society movements (which was just after WWII) the slower infrastructure improves from one year to the next, something visible not just in trains but at all levels (even National Health Services for those countries which have them).

The same thing will happen in China now that they're getting more Capitalist than Socialist.

It was never the Capitalist part doing the kind of improvements that benefit most people, it was the stuff outside Capitalism (that used it as a Trade Philosophy only) constraining it and guiding it for policy ends which were independent of Capitalism.

This slowing of improvements of course itself accelerated with Neoliberalism, since that stuff is mainly about making Capitalism the sole definer of policy, or in other words make Capitalism the entirety of politics, hence unconstrained and unguided by interests other than those of Money, so ever less policy was done for the greater good.

Capitalism is reasonably decent at optimizing Trade in the short and mid-term, but is completelly shit for non-Trade interests such as Quality Of Life, as well as for anything which doesn't have direct and reasonably immediate action-consequence links such as situations where negative effects are very delayed in time (for example, companies enshittifying their products but keeping on going for years on the inertia of brand name) or emergent in nature (i.e. things that appear due to the accumulation of the actions of many actors, such as Global Warming).

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[–] rumba@lemmy.zip 16 points 6 days ago (6 children)

I wonder if the early proliferation of rural cars / mega expressways kinda fucked us. When your transportation network grows around trains, upgrading the trains/rails makes good economic sense. We just kind of spread out everywhere quickly and made the train locations somewhat irrelevant.

[–] Pacattack57@lemmy.world 20 points 6 days ago (2 children)

No the auto industry has lobbied against trains and similar projects. It’s not about the science but more about how our politicians have been selling their souls for centuries.

[–] redwattlebird@lemmings.world 5 points 6 days ago

Pretty much part of the plot from Who Framed Roger Rabbit.

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[–] Mniot@programming.dev 13 points 6 days ago

No, because cross-country trains and heavy use of them to move goods and people predates cars by quite a bit. Trains were a key component of the North winning the Civil War, for example.

Lots of existing train infrastructure needed to be torn out to make room for car infrastructure.

[–] newaccountwhodis@lemmy.ml 2 points 4 days ago (3 children)

We just kind of spread out everywhere quickly and made the train locations somewhat irrelevant.

Do you know any US history

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[–] j_z@feddit.nu 10 points 6 days ago

I definitely think this is the case. Something akin to tragedy of the commons (or maybe Braese’s paradox?) where small investments for short term gain trumps bigger investments for, comparatively, bigger gains.

Sweden, where I live, is in this situation too where the rail network is 50 years in reparation debt but it’s easier for politicians to budget for small road repairs and say that they make meaningful infrastructure work

[–] Ronno 6 points 6 days ago

If anything, shouldn't that make it easier? The US has quite open and wide streets/roads. You have more space to build stations and rail tracks than for example Europe with much narrower streets/roads.

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[–] WanderWisley@lemmy.world 15 points 6 days ago (1 children)

Not just trains but all transportation services and systems is severely lacking in this country. Along with crumbling infrastructure and terrible build quality of cars and trucks and you got a recipe for disaster. But no one will care cuz Merica!

[–] Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 4 days ago (1 children)

yeah it's so funny when people think the US has good car infrastructure, the truth is that the US just generally fucking sucks

yeah sure there's a lot of interstate highways which i guess you can consider good, but most people aren't using them for very large distances, most people are driving to and from work every day and that part is so hilariously miserable that i don't think people in the rest of the world truly believe it's a real thing that happens..

[–] WanderWisley@lemmy.world 2 points 4 days ago (1 children)

Agreed! I live in a very rural part of the country and the conditions of the roads and highways are laughable.

[–] Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 3 days ago

not just that, but the design itself is often actively counterproductive, and the fact that driving is often the only way to get around means the roads are forced to handle an insane amount of traffic.

i like to say that the nordics are an example of actual car-centric design: the roads are simple and efficient and the other modes of transport are good enough, which means there aren't thousands and thousands of incompetent and unwilling drivers on the roads.

[–] dan69@lemmy.world 14 points 6 days ago (4 children)

America: if ain’t broke don’t fix it Every other country: yah it’s time, what are our new requirements?

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[–] Prior_Industry@lemmy.world 8 points 6 days ago

Hyperloop any day now!

[–] xorollo@leminal.space 9 points 6 days ago

That conductor is a total hottie tho

[–] Honytawk 6 points 6 days ago (2 children)

Well, the most efficient form of government is a dictatorship, which nobody want except the dictator.

An inefficient government has groups investigating other groups to see if what they are doing is correct. This process takes time, so things move much slower. But is generally a much better protection against corruption.

[–] RedFrank24@lemmy.world 7 points 6 days ago (1 children)

You say that, but... Iraq was a dictatorship, and they weren't all that efficient at anything other than killing Kurds.

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[–] FooBarrington@lemmy.world 4 points 6 days ago

Well, the most efficient form of government is a dictatorship, which nobody want except the dictator.

I mean... some people do, but they're weird.

[–] nexguy@lemmy.world 4 points 5 days ago (2 children)

Weird to compare a brutal dictatorship which violates human rights on the regular vs a democracy which violates human rights a little less.

[–] teamevil@lemmy.world 8 points 5 days ago

So far...give Trump time and he'll catch right up.

[–] newaccountwhodis@lemmy.ml 2 points 4 days ago

a brutal dictatorship which violates human rights on the regular

Don't you think you're a little harsh on the US?

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