Leopards Ate My Face
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Trump was never on your side, now you're finding out the hard way :|
Please remember it is important to not gloat or "I told you so". This person, for a reason of which does not matter, has decided to exit the cult. This person needs support and praise for their bravery. I don't care if it is for a selfish reason.... ultimately they made it out, their mind is free! That is cause for celebration.
Idk seems like that decision was made FOR him and not by him
A not-insignificant portion of Trump's base will be in this boat, if they aren't already. We should be ready with messaging to pull them out of the cult, so that they don't fall back in.
Heres the problem. We kept the gloating and "I told you so" to a minimum after Trump round 1 and the Civil war.
Hammer it home. They need to know Every. Fucking. Minute. Of every. Fucking. Day. That the choices they made got them fired, took their job, and ruined their country. Almost everyone knew it was going to happen and warned them, and they just dug deeper with their knee-jerk "nuh-uh" fake news 3rd grade playground bully logic. They need to know beyond a doubt that they are stupid, short-sighted, easily manipulated bigots. Why? Because the only way they can change it and do better is if they fucking know it, believe it, and see that they need to change it.
I think the "I treat people like shit and expect them to change their view because of it" is harmful.
This is not how you change a mind. This is how to get sombody to double down on their bullshit who where ready to change their views.
It depends.
When the group hurts you through its own incompetence, you can land in hard times and still believe the ideals of that group. The ability for people to rationalize things is incredibly powerful.
Now let’s say that the trump supporter is ready to no longer support trump now that they’ve been personally victimized. Where they end up can be a massive spectrum. Cult followers tend to idolize and forge parasocial relationships with their cult leader.
You might think that you are seeing them reject trumpism and all it stands for, when in reality it’s much closer to someone feeling betrayed by someone they believed they had a close personal relationship with. Their rejection of the cult has nothing to do with what the cult believes, but comes from a reaction to a feeling of betrayal by the beloved cult figure.
In that case the fertile ground to win hearts and minds isn't there. There are excellent case studies of this “embrace to change minds” strategy working.Daryl Davis converting 200 Ku klux klanmen is an inspiring story, and one that many point to to support the idea of embracing people instead of punishing them.
The problem is that this isn’t the same situation. Daryl Davis was willing to spend years talking with, and building relationships with people that actively hated him. He didn’t go to people who had a tiff with their local klan leader and tell them “it’s ok buddy, let’s be friends now, I forgive you.” Instead he put in a tremendous amount of effort to build relationships which made it impossible for these guys to continue to hold on to their bigoted beliefs
So what’s the danger in not treating these people like shit? Even if it were ineffective, isn’t it better to just be nice to them anyways? We have a contemporary example to draw from, reconstruction.
After the us civil war there was a difference of opinion much the same as the one we argue today. And we tried the gentler approach
As it became clear that the war would end in a Union victory, Congress debated the process for the readmission of the seceded states. Radicaland moderate Republicans disagreed over the nature of secession, the conditions for readmission, and the desirability of social reforms as a consequence of the Confederate defeat. Lincoln favored the "ten percent plan" and vetoed the radical Wade–Davis Bill, which proposed strict conditions for readmission.
Lincoln was assassinated on April 14, 1865, just as fighting was drawing to a close. He was replaced by President Andrew Johnson. Johnson vetoed numerous Radical Republican bills, he pardoned thousands of Confederate leaders, and he allowed Southern states to pass draconian Black Codesthat restricted the rights of freedmen. His actions outraged many Northerners and stoked fears that the Southern elite would regain its political power. Radical Republican candidates swept to power in the 1866 midterm elections, gaining large majorities in both houses of Congress.
Many argue that the confederacy and its ideals never truly died. The light touch, left many holding regressive ideals in places of power. They had not given up their ideals, they just couldn’t be a part of the group anymore.
In most cases the argument is somewhat moot. The most likely scenario is that my relationship (and most peoples relationship) with some random trump supporter that gets kicked in the nuts by trump will be the same as before, no relationship at all. In the rare situation that this person is someone you do plan to forge a relationship with (either net new or reestablishing some previous relationship) I think it is neither wise to “treat them like shit” nor “let them off the hook”
Instead it should be a careful assessment of what they actually believe. Do they still blame immigrants and trans people for everything that’s wrong in their life but just don’t like that trump fired then, then they can kindly go fuck themselves. They haven’t learned any lesson, they just don’t like that they had something bad happen to them. Sure give them a chance, don’t immediately piss all over them, but if the only problem they have is that it finally directly impacted them, they are no ally.
If it’s a catalyst for true and lasting change, sure nurture that.
Right, because telling people "they're special and nice and it's not their fault that the orange dictator is ruining the country" has historically never ever worked once.
You can point out the issue without being a dick to them.
Nobody has ever left the alt-right cult by being insulted and belittled, in fact that's how they usually get recruited in the cult.
You know? Honestly, telling them they lost their job, house and country because they joined a political cult led by a spray-tanned \wish.com hitler wannabe, isn't really the "being an asshole" thing that you think it is, and more along the lines of just telling them to truth to their faces.
No, MAGAts revel in the misery they cause .. thay love "owning the libs" and literally want nothing else in life. Nothing. They are fueled by an insane level of hatred and cruelty. It is all they understand. When you point and laugh at them for the "face eating" ... they actually get it. MAGAts do not leave their cult, they just get displaced until the next cult that let's them be hateful racists comes around.
All my Trump neighbors are rental tenants so they get shuffled in and out every year by their landlords. A few MAGA banner fliers as well as a few families with small kids all got kicked out my neighborhood this last year for Sale signs to go up.
They were tricked by a propaganda machine. They may have been willing participants but had they known everything they never would have voted against their own interests. Yet every country in the western hemisphere, South America, Africa, Asia, and well everywhere doesn't have anti propaganda laws. If you're rich you can buy influence in any neo liberal country. Why is that?
How do you construct anti-propaganda laws that can't be used by bad actors to silence dissent? Genuine question if you have an answer but I don't think anyone actually does. The only actual counter to propaganda is quality education, which is where the US has been failing dramatically.
You have to target entities that knowingly lie and portray themselves as serious. Anti fraud laws with teeth.
The trump sign probably only came down so they could put it back up at whatever trailer park they move into. They’ll gladly vote for the next trump-aligned fascist. These people are incapable of learning.
Gonna be complaining DEI made him lose his job and Biden's taxes made him lose his house
Yup. Realtor likely took it down because any political flag will devalue a house or turn away potential buyers.
Trump crap was taken down on any neighbor’s homes (and there weren’t many) except one (and they have it kinda hidden) after 2020. Anyone supporting Trump at this point is an idiot, cruel, or both.
Agent Krasnov is, by ALL objective measures, the most prolific Traitor in American history. In fact, he has probably caused more damage than ALL other American traitors COMBINED.
At this point, anyone who still supports HitlerPig is as much an authentic traitor as he is. I only wish the very worst outcomes for them. Losing their jobs and homes is the mildest punishment they deserve.
I operate a business, and I havent had to hire anyone lately. But if I were, I would absolutely ask them who they supported for president in 2020 and 2024, which is perfectly legal. Anyone who voted for HitlerPig would be immediately, and rudely, be rejected. I won't employ anyone with such obviously poor Critical Thinking Skills.
Trump support has been on full display in my area without interruption. "Don't blame me, I voted for Trump" are the ones I'm keeping my eyes on the most, waiting for them to disappear.
Thots and pears.
I wonder sometimes if it is self defeating to brow beat, say "I told you so", or rub someone's face in it. Enjoyable as it may be.
Some people only learn when something bad happens to them.
Perhaps in private, but not if you remind them.
Consider this. Your asshole detestable uncle loses his house. On the one hand you can text him and say you deserve what you get you piece of shit.
Or invite him over to watch a baseball game. Avoid politics. Quietly remind him not everyone is a piece of shit.
Which do you think will more likely change his mind? Or which one will he double down on, write it off as an accident, and go deeper down the hole. I took one for the team.
It's kind of scary that 3 weeks is all it took for them to list their home.
It’s kind of scary that 3 weeks is all it took for them to list their home.
The neighbor is part of the (in 2019) 51%.
"Most Working Americans Would Face Economic Hardship If They Missed More than One Paycheck"
Bet he also had a $100k truck parked in front of that home. Bought with a loan with 12% interest
We really need a Herman Cain Award for Trumpers who have lost their livelihoods. I used to love the old compilations of dozens of posts only to have the inevitable "COVID ain't no joke".
Covid deniers when their opponent is covid