this post was submitted on 08 Jul 2025
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Red meat has a huge carbon footprint because cattle requires a large amount of land and water.

https://sph.tulane.edu/climate-and-food-environmental-impact-beef-consumption

Demand for steaks and burgers is the primary driver of Deforestation:

https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2022-beef-industry-fueling-amazon-rainforest-destruction-deforestation/

https://e360.yale.edu/features/marcel-gomes-interview

https://www.thebureauinvestigates.com/stories/2023-06-02/almost-a-billion-trees-felled-to-feed-appetite-for-brazilian-beef

If you don't have a car and rarely eat red meat, you are doing GREAT 🙌🙌 🙌

Sure, you can drink tap water instead of plastic water. You can switch to Tea. You can travel by train. You can use Linux instead of Windows AI's crap. Those are great ideas. But, don't drive yourself crazy. If you are only an ordinary citizen, remember that perfect is the enemy of good.

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[–] blue_skull@lemmy.world 22 points 3 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (8 children)

I could devote all my time to recycling, reducing carbon emissions, not driving, voting, not eating red meat, including forcing everyone i know to do the same - and the net result would be an iota of a drop in the ocean of change. i.e. nothing.

As others have said, until there is a global shift on how the world operates and the major oil companies, cruise lines, and airlines all shut down, nothing you or i can do will matter.

Edit: folks still don't get it. It's not a matter of apathy, it's pragmatism. You will never, ever convince enough people to make a significant change relative to the big consumers. You will be dealing with the people who literally pollute and consume out of spite, and/or principle, or ignorance. For every thing you do, someone's doing the opposite. We failed the planet a long time ago though lack of education and giving too many greedy people power. The world is too large and the snowball is over the hill.

The amount of fuel used by the cruise industry in about 1 minute, on average, is more fuel than you or I or any normal person would consume in their entire lifetime, by a lot. That's on the low end. They consume 500,000 to 1.5 mil gallons an hour. The average person uses maybe 20 to 50k gallons their entire lives. You'd have to convince millions and millions of people to stop driving completely for 40 years to offset that. Tens of millions probably.

Not gonna happen. That's just one industry.

Everyone's not gonna just stop flying. Or stop driving. Or stop eating meat. It's idealistic and impossible and frankly imaginary, no matter how much it may be necessary.

Why waste your time and energy doing things that will do nothing? Focus your efforts elsewhere. Policy change probably has the best chance of helping. But then I point back to the people actively and purposely thwarting any attempts at curbing consumption, and these people are billionaires etc. And at least in the USA, running the country.

[–] LaLuzDelSol@lemmy.world 18 points 3 days ago (2 children)

Airlines, cruise lined oil companies are not immutable forces of nature. They have grown to their current size to meet the demand of individuals like you and me who want to buy shit and go places.

If everyone stopped flying, passenger airlines would be out of business and no longer flying planes within a year or two. Same with cruise companies. Oil is used in more things but if everyone switched to EVs or stopped driving oil production would go way down- even more if we cut our plastic usage as well.

Don't fall into the trap of thinking consumers are powerless. In a free market economy they are very powerful- that's why boycotts can be so effective.

[–] LanguageIsCool@lemmy.world 11 points 3 days ago

Seriously. Some people here are so happy they’ve found the “perfect” justification for their apathy and inaction.

[–] daq@lemmy.sdf.org -1 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Could you name a few successful boycotts? I did a quick search and recent examples don't seem that successful to me. Amazon is still doing amazingly well and Nestlé is still killing people.

[–] LaLuzDelSol@lemmy.world 4 points 2 days ago

Sure, let me google that for you.

https://www.ethicalconsumer.org/ethicalcampaigns/boycotts/history-successful-boycotts

In general boycotts are less about driving a company to bankruptcy and more about getting them to change their behavior. Some companies are surprisingly immune to boycotts but many others have walked back their problematic behavior. Notably in recent memory in the US I can think of Barilla, Chick-fil-a and (by conservatives) Budweiser. The Montgomery bus line boycott is the stuff of history.

[–] LanguageIsCool@lemmy.world 6 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (1 children)

Your edit makes me wish I could downvote this again. Your flawed logic can be used to excuse a number of ridiculous and fucked up shit. “Folks just don’t get it.” Fuck off with that bullshit.

It’s not apathy it’s pragmatism? But then you rant about how nothing matters.

Better to spend time and energy elsewhere? So you spend time and energy convincing others to be as apathetic and weak as you. So weak you needed to desperately justify your apathy to yourself and to others by editing your comment.

Don’t wanna eat less meat? Go for it dawg. Eat it up. Don’t give a fuck about deforestation? The fucked up conditions animals are raised in? The pollution and everything that comes with it? Just because cruises are wasteful? You do you, big dawg.

But to tell everyone else to not give a fuck either is just some absurd fucked up apathetic shit. It’s not pragmatic. It’s so obvious you lie to yourself. The audacity to say “folks just don’t get it.”

[–] blue_skull@lemmy.world 0 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (1 children)

I'm just laughing cause you still don't get it. Nothing you do will matter. Yes, that's depressing, and it's also true. The numbers don't check out. You can wave it away all you want, nothing you do will matter. Sorry. And yes that should make you angry. But that is what I mean by pragmatism. It's a waste of time and energy to be angry. To believe you can do something about it. Instead, focus on being happy and making life better for others in ways we can, in the time we have.

[–] LanguageIsCool@lemmy.world 0 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (1 children)

Trust me, I get it more than you. I try to live with principles instead of just thinking whether “it’ll matter” and being a coward because billionaires ride jets and rich people take cruises.

You’re “just laughing” and thinking you’re above me, explaining to me your idiocy as if I don’t see how pathetic you actually are.

[–] blue_skull@lemmy.world 0 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Nope, you still don't get it, lol.

We lost.

[–] LanguageIsCool@lemmy.world 0 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

“I have no principles because people take cruises and I believe nobody else should have principles either.”

I believe it’s all gonna collapse too. That doesn’t mean I cry in the drive thru line waiting for a bacon burger then go on Lemmy and build a facade that I’m enlightened just because I understand the extremely simple fact that humans fucked up the planet. And then “laugh” at people with principles as if having principles means they “don’t get it,” when the modern meat industry, for one, is an absolute horror show that causes so much present harm beyond emissions to not just the animals.

You’re hilariously inconsistent too for someone who “gets it.” In your other comment you’re telling people to focus energy where it matters, but here now you’re saying nothing matters and that “we lost.”

People who “get it” don’t go around telling people that they're laughing and that they get it.

Maybe resolve your inner conflicts first before you tell people what to do and what not do to, oh enlightened laughing one.

[–] blue_skull@lemmy.world 1 points 56 minutes ago

The number of assumptions you make about my "principles" are ridiculous. You are reading way too far into the like 100 words I wrote. You sound super pissed and projecting a lot onto me.

All that garble to tell me no, you still don't get it.

[–] butwhyishischinabook@lemmy.world 14 points 3 days ago (1 children)

A quarter of emissions is nothing? Yeah the overwhelming majority is attributable to major oil companies, but you're just being lazy and fatalistic. But sure, just sit there and wait for a paradigm shift to come save you from yourself I guess. Literally the first two search results I found:

https://www.dw.com/en/fact-check-is-eating-meat-bad-for-the-environment/a-63595148 https://www.c2es.org/content/regulating-transportation-sector-carbon-emissions/

[–] hans@feddit.org -1 points 2 days ago

from your article:

That said, other areas of life are a bigger source of greenhouse gases — for instance the transport and aviation sector. Driving 10,000 kilometers (6,000 miles) a year causes over 2 tons in CO2 equivalents, as does a round-trip flight from Europe to New York. That figure doubles when you fly from Europe to Asia or South America.

[–] fuck_u_spez_in_particular@lemmy.world 8 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Right but you have to begin somewhere, and being a good example for others certainly helps as well.

I try to change my life such that it doesn't impact me much while having fairly large effect. For instance I'm basically vegan (still eat meat occasionally, e.g. when it's otherwise thrown away), I even don't want to eat meat anymore, the taste just got worse for me over time.

It also has effects on the market, e.g. Meat replacement products are quite affordable and popular.

[–] sunzu2@thebrainbin.org 1 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Stop flying for vacation... That alone will do more than all of deit adjustments

I didn't fly for years either (nor I do possess a car), so yeah agree, or at least reduce this as much as possible.

But nutrition also has quite an impact, especially when we must consider that highly carbon rich forests still get destructed for (inefficient) food. The high amount of meat consumption in rich countries is unhealthy as well.

[–] LanguageIsCool@lemmy.world 6 points 3 days ago

It wouldn't be nothing and you know that. If you simplify the meat problem to just emissions, sure, it might look small in comparison to cruises, etc. But if you look at it as the multifaceted problem it really is, then reducing consumption will have several effects. Especially, as you exaggerated, if you forced everyone you know to do the same.

The last thing we need is people advocating for these "fuck it" attitudes. Should we really excuse better choices and better directions of behavior and culture just because there's a "small" effect? I feel like this line of logic can be used to excuse some pretty dark shit.

[–] wampus@lemmy.ca 3 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Yeah, cruise lines opening back up and returning to business as usual after COVID, basically made me stop paying attention to a lot of this individual-targeted climate change stuff. That was a perfect and fairly natural way to end that high pollution luxury oriented industry, but everyone basically said "boomers still like cruising, so fuck the planet".

If boomers and rich people can continue to pollute at incredible rates, just give me my stupid plastic straw back. At least that way I can drink a full mlikshake before my straw turns into paper mache, while I watch the world burn.

[–] sunzu2@thebrainbin.org 9 points 3 days ago (2 children)

I don't think we should give up on reasonable direct action but going after what people eat when there is the elephant in the room like flying and toursim generally along with crusies... It is kinda insulting to the poors IMHO

[–] wampus@lemmy.ca 2 points 2 days ago (1 children)

You do you. For my part, honestly, even going over board on recycling is off the table. I'll separate bottles and stuff, but spending excessive time doing stuff like collecting grease to put in compost bins feels pointless and meaningless -- why would I put myself out, spend a buncha time doing that kinda stuff, while rich people are buying up Venice to have a Private Jet orgy, and a ton of media hypes it up as though it's awesome / they have no fall out from it? I have more respect for my own mental health than to internalise the guilt of it all, when every rich person out there is happily burning everything to the ground, and the majority of the poors are cheering them on for doing it.

Like I said in another post, even "Climate leaders" like David Suzuki owns like 4-5 houses, and jets between them for shits and giggles. It's all a joke, you may as well not punish yourself over it if you can't be fucked to do some of the small shit.

[–] leftytighty@slrpnk.net 2 points 2 days ago (1 children)

if you think the problem is capitalism and rich people why not put your efforts towards that instead of recycling? Instead, you just want an excuse to do nothing.

[–] wampus@lemmy.ca 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Because I have zero motivation to do so at this point.

[–] leftytighty@slrpnk.net 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Remember that when your life and the life of your loved ones is shit. Grandpa just couldn't be fucked to take any action.

[–] wampus@lemmy.ca 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Yes, kids would potentially be a motivator. We can see how well they motivate those tech ceos to focus on climate change issues, with their tech fascist eugenics-like breeding programs producing numerous spawn. That telegram dude with like 100 kids must be the most Eco-conscious guy on the planet.

[–] leftytighty@slrpnk.net 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Post has no point, smoother than your brain

[–] wampus@lemmy.ca 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Least I'm not stupid enough to think that I'd motivate someone on the internet by insulting them. So I must have at least one wrinkle in there somewhere ;p

[–] leftytighty@slrpnk.net 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Shame is a good motivator for people that have it

[–] wampus@lemmy.ca 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Political leaders / rich people are goose-stepping around in public, rich people are having private jet fuck parties in Venice as they burn the ecosystem to the ground, "climate leaders" like Suzuki are living high-polluting lifestyles, "climate celebs" like DiCaprio are equally depraved and two-faced, "popular" celebs like the Kardashians and Taylor are well known for taking incredibly wasteful luxury private jet trips. They all likely generate more pollution in a week than I will in my entire lifetime, and the public praises these sorts from all sides of the spectrum.

I vote green (in Canada), doesn't matter. I end up with an NDP government provincially (left leaning party), doesn't matter. No political party is willing to take drastic steps on this front. Even these nation building projects Carney's on about here in Canada, are just him suppressing Canadians' rights so that US companies can exfiltrate resources like Oil - and he was the more 'progressive' pick compared to the other potential leading party.

Like I said, I ain't gonna be ashamed of bein lazy in my recycling. My personal climate footprint is tinier than most, and far smaller than those people. Even if I get that plastic straw it's still nothing compared to any of them.

[–] leftytighty@slrpnk.net 1 points 2 days ago

The question isn't whether others are doing more harm than you, the question is whether your lifestyle would scale up such that if everyone lived like you, would we be sustainable?

Yours is the small scale version of the Canadian and American excuse that China emits more in absolute numbers despite being much better than us per capita.

Stop making excuses, take personal action.

[–] LanguageIsCool@lemmy.world 2 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Plenty of not poor people eat too much meat

[–] sunzu2@thebrainbin.org 1 points 3 days ago (1 children)

They also fly and vacation a lot more too lol

[–] LanguageIsCool@lemmy.world 5 points 3 days ago (1 children)

I honestly don’t know what your message is. Rich people shouldn’t fly but they can eat meat? Neither? Poor people should eat meat but not fly? Both? Neither? Middle class people?

[–] sunzu2@thebrainbin.org -3 points 3 days ago (2 children)

Flying is bigger issue than eating red meat long with tourism generally.

While reducing red meat is good... Targeting beef as solution is disingenuous at best. Likely a shill op

Generally people who shill it are also the worst offenders about flying and tourism.

You can eat all vegan all your life but once you fly or go on the cruise... It doesn't matter.

[–] LanguageIsCool@lemmy.world 8 points 3 days ago

I didn’t realize flying was destroying ocean ecosystems by overfishing and deforesting the Amazon.

All of this can be bad. All of it can be called out. You don’t have to cancel one with the other. You don’t have to call people who point at the meat problem “shills.”

[–] leftytighty@slrpnk.net 2 points 2 days ago

If someone is beating the shit out of you and someone else is pissing on your face, assuming you're not into it, would you say it's not worth stopping the guy beating on you because you'll still be pissed on?

[–] Tollana1234567@lemmy.today 2 points 3 days ago

people need to get over the idea of not earting farmed bugs, its more efficient and eco-friendly.

[–] stinky@redlemmy.com 1 points 2 days ago

Unless there's an oil exec that lives nearby.