overview for Blaze

Every step forwards is a step forwards in c/buyeuropean@feddit.uk

[–] Blaze 10 points 2 weeks ago (3 children)

It is, but at least the CEO does not make Nazi salutes

Join Us in Building Europe Pub: Community Builders and Moderators Wanted! in c/europePub@europe.pub

[–] Blaze 1 points 2 weeks ago

Firstly, !moviesandtv@lemm.ee still has 2,500 subscribers, while !showsandmovies@lemm.ee only has 1,500 at this point. Additionally, the moderators are now directing users to !television@lemm.ee, which has even fewer subscribers (around 200), as mentioned in this post.

!showsandmovies@lemm.ee is by far the most active community on this topic: (https://lemmyverse.net/communities?query=tv+shows&order=active)

Subscribers are not a relevant metric as !moviesandtv@lemm.ee was created during the API exodus, but a lot of people left since then. Active users is a better metric.

Rather than a clean transition, this situation has resulted in a fractured community.

I know, I am that mod. This decision is actually a way to consolidate the existing communities on that topic

So this is consolidation rather than fracturing. The first two communities have been locked. Should the mod team of !television@lemm.ee start to power trip, people can ask the lemm.ee admins to get one of the two others communities back and move there.

Secondly, in this case, the issue was malicious moderation. Users left because of bad mod behavior, but the real concern remains: admins have the final say. If an admin decides to power trip, the entire community—and potentially the whole instance—falls under their control.

!tenforward@lemmy.world was created as an alternative from power tripping admins on strartrek.website, and is now the most active community about Star Trek. So even power tripping admins can be dealt with. @Stamets@lemmy.world can attest.

In contrast, a decentralized approach with similar communities on different instances offers a natural fail-safe. If one instance becomes problematic, users can easily regroup on other similar communities rather than having to start from scratch. This ensures continuity and resilience rather than the all-or-nothing risk of centralization.

You can have alternative communities locked, so that they are ready to be used, but still keep the conversations happening on the main community.

Whether or not this happens depends on developer support

Indeed, but it is not implemented at the moment. Should the mods of /r/BuyfromEU ask us which Lemmy community we want to add to their sidebar, which one should give them? Should we give them the 4 of them just because we can't decide on one?

The question isn’t whether consolidation is the only way to improve discussion efficiency—it’s whether it’s the best way. And given the risks of power concentration, it seems clear that a better solution lies in improving the tools rather than weakening decentralization.

Where are the alternative active communities to

People don't want to shout into the void. They go where the people are. Another example:

https://feddit.nl/post/30598218 161 upvotes, 10 comments
https://feddit.nl/post/30596578 27 upvotes, 0 comment
https://feddit.nl/post/30602071 13 upvotes, 0 comment

This is a natural phenomenon. When Lemmy will have a bigger userbase (e.g. 100k monthly active users), we could maybe have parallel communities about specific topics, but at the moment, it seems counterproductive.

Join Us in Building Europe Pub: Community Builders and Moderators Wanted! in c/europePub@europe.pub

[–] Blaze 1 points 2 weeks ago (6 children)

Thank you for your comment

The idea of migrating communities when moderation becomes problematic sounds good in theory, but in practice, it rarely works, especially as the network scales up. It’s also cumbersome. People don’t want to uproot and start over repeatedly, and large communities don’t just “move” smoothly. Instead, they tend to fracture, lose engagement, or remain stuck under poor leadership.

People left !moviesandtv@lemm.ee after the power tripping: https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/29606682. !showsandmovies@lemm.ee became the most active community

!onehundredninetysix@lemmy.blahaj.zone is also another example: https://feddit.org/post/7025680/4263481

get that, but this feels like a problem that should be solved at the platform level rather than by consolidating communities. People should be able to subscribe to multiple similar communities across different instances, and the feed algorithm should be able to detect and bundle similar posts across these communities. However, it should not decide which content is “best”. It should simply organize the feed more efficiently without interfering with visibility.

This is not going to happen any time soon for Lemmy, and even though Piefed has feeds, the issue stays the same: if a question about European luggage is listed on 3 different communities, people are not going to copy paste their answers in the 3 communities, leading to discussion splintering

In the end, this is the ongoing dilemma of decentralization: Do we prioritize distribution of power, or do we focus on ease of use? There’s no perfect answer, but we should aim for a balance rather than rushing to consolidate.

I am in favor of having one community, !buyeuropean@feddit.uk , due to the good track record of the instance admins.

Should the mods start power tripping, people can organize on !europe@feddit.org

I've updated the Digital Independence cheat sheet for leaving big tech in c/buyeuropean@feddit.uk

[–] Blaze 0 points 2 weeks ago

Nice, thanks!

Join Us in Building Europe Pub: Community Builders and Moderators Wanted! in c/europePub@europe.pub

[–] Blaze 1 points 2 weeks ago

Pinging the !buyeuropean@feddit.uk mods: @Argyle13@lemmy.world @Sunshine@lemmy.ca @Lazycog@sopuli.xyz @Emperor@feddit.uk

Join Us in Building Europe Pub: Community Builders and Moderators Wanted! in c/europePub@europe.pub

[–] Blaze -1 points 2 weeks ago (9 children)

Hello,

Copy pasting what I put in another post on !BuyFromEU@lemm.ee

My personal stance on this is that

If rules, moderation policies and admin policies are similar, there should only be one community on a single topic while we have a userbase below 100k

This allows for !politics@lemmy.world and !politics@hexbear.net to coexist, as there is a reason for them to (different moderation policies). It's similar for !climate@slrpnk.net and !climatehope@lemmy.world, as those communities have different principles and perspectives on their topic.

This suggests to consolidate communities like !movies@lemmy.world and !movies@lemm.ee

Another recent example is

!buyeuropean@feddit.uk
!buyfromeu@feddit.org
there is now a third community, !BuyFromEU@europe.pub

These three communities have similar rules, similar moderation and admin policies. They should be consolidated. And I know this is a very controversial topic, but I made a longer post recently on !yepowertrippinbastards@lemmy.dbzer0.com for people interested.

In summary, my main argument is that

even though subscribers can potentially subscribe to all communities on a topic
posters are only going to post to one community, because they want the conversation to happen with the most people in one place, which is not the case if you crosspost as the comments gets splintered across the different communities

To take a recent example

As a member of both communities, I find it a pain to have two similar communities even more so when both post the exact same content because it creates more noise in my feed and because it forces me to waste my time and energy deciding where I will read said duplicated content and maybe post a comment. The solution is obvious: I will unsubscribe from one (for the time being, I still follow the two communities).

https://jlai.lu/post/16318139/13038429

There is a natural tendency of "one community emerges as the main one" on several topics

If one community does not emerge as the main one, it's usually because two or more regular posters maintain both communities active by posting to their preferred community.

!movies@lemmy.world vs !movies@lemm.ee
!android@lemmy.world vs !android@lemdro.id
all the privacy communities that are active at the same time

So, my suggestions are to consolidate similar communities. This single decision will not make this platform similar to Reddit. On Reddit, you had no way to complain about power tripping mods, there were no public modlogs, and discourse criticizing the mods or the admins would get silenced.

Here, we have !yepowertrippinbastards@lemmy.dbzer0.com, and recent examples have shown that the community can actually resist power tripping: https://feddit.org/post/7025680/4263481.

If the mods of the consolidated community start to power trip, document this on !yepowertrippinbastards@lemmy.dbzer0.com and reorganize on the alternative communities. If not, stay on that one community, to foster more active conversations and posts.

That's the theory we encourage on !fedigrow@lemm.ee, feel free to join us there to discuss this further.

Meditations - Medito Foundation - alternative app to Down dog in c/buyeuropean@feddit.uk

[–] Blaze 3 points 2 weeks ago

Thank you for the additional context!

It's starting to become a bit ridiculous in c/BuyFromEU@lemm.ee

[–] Blaze 9 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

And I'm just going to copy paste what I put in another posts about crossposts

My personal stance on this is that

If rules, moderation policies and admin policies are similar, there should only be one community on a single topic while we have a userbase below 100k

This allows for !politics@lemmy.world and !politics@hexbear.net to coexist, as there is a reason for them to (different moderation policies). It's similar for !climate@slrpnk.net and !climatehope@lemmy.world, as those communities have different principles and perspectives on their topic.

This suggests to consolidate communities like !movies@lemmy.world and !movies@lemm.ee

Another recent example is

!buyeuropean@feddit.uk
!buyfromeu@feddit.org
there is now a third community, !BuyFromEU@europe.pub

These three communities have similar rules, similar moderation and admin policies. They should be consolidated. And I know this is a very controversial topic, but I made a longer post recently on !yepowertrippinbastards@lemmy.dbzer0.com for people interested.

In summary, my main argument is that

even though subscribers can potentially subscribe to all communities on a topic
posters are only going to post to one community, because they want the conversation to happen with the most people in one place, which is not the case if you crosspost as the comments gets splintered across the different communities

To take a recent example

As a member of both communities, I find it a pain to have two similar communities even more so when both post the exact same content because it creates more noise in my feed and because it forces me to waste my time and energy deciding where I will read said duplicated content and maybe post a comment. The solution is obvious: I will unsubscribe from one (for the time being, I still follow the two communities).

https://jlai.lu/post/16318139/13038429

There is a natural tendency of "one community emerges as the main one" on several topics

If one community does not emerge as the main one, it's usually because two or more regular posters maintain both communities active by posting to their preferred community.

!movies@lemmy.world vs !movies@lemm.ee
!android@lemmy.world vs !android@lemdro.id
all the privacy communities that are active at the same time

So, my suggestions are to consolidate similar communities. This single decision will not make this platform similar to Reddit. On Reddit, you had no way to complain about power tripping mods, there were no public modlogs, and discourse criticizing the mods or the admins would get silenced.

Here, we have !yepowertrippinbastards@lemmy.dbzer0.com, and recent examples have shown that the community can actually resist power tripping: https://feddit.org/post/7025680/4263481.

If the mods of the consolidated community start to power trip, document this on !yepowertrippinbastards@lemmy.dbzer0.com and reorganize on the alternative communities. If not, stay on that one community, to foster more active conversations and posts.