Update: Although we officially still have a few days remaining on this vote, it seems clear that this proposal won't be voted in.
Thanks to everyone for their feedback and votes! I had expected a split vote on this one and it turned out around 1/3 for the proposal and 2/3 against, so that is a quite emphatic no! And of course, we will respect the vote.
I hope we can maybe revisit our instance blocking policies more generally after lemmy has properly working per-user instance blocks, as some folks commented as it will open up more options for personal choice. For example, we could keep a list of sanctioned instances (like csam site) as it works now, but maintain a separate list of "use with caution" instances (aka hesitations in fediseer) that are blocked by default in each user's personal blocklist. But now users could choose to enable those sites for themselves if they wanted to.
For me, that seems like the best overall solution for user choice, and for the new user experience. But it may not sound good to you folks, so that's why we have the voting system in place so we can get quality feedback and also hopefully generate ideas for improvements that will benefit the community.
On that note, anyone can contact me or any of the site admins if they have a proposal they want to appear here on the governance community, and we'll be happy to help you out.
Unruffled
Hi mateys. I'm gonna keep this short and sweet because I don't really have any skin in the game on this one. I am in fact quite happy to leave this decision up to the wider dbzer0 community. On that note, please do not comment on this post unless you are a dbzer0 user - we'd prefer not to have anyone else weighing in.
This post isn't to convince anyone to re-federate or otherwise. In fact, our admin team genuinely doesn't know for sure what our community sentiment is on the topic, or whether or not it's worth a try. My guess is that the community will be quite divided on the topic, as many users are on the topic of hexbear. But the only way to find out for sure is to ask you, so here we are.
But I will say that for me personally, although we still have the occasional drama, and despite past run-ins, I have slowly grown to appreciate having some hexbear users around to help balance out all the turbolibs. While I think its fair to say our instance and theirs will never see eye-to-eye on certain topics, we have coexisted with them in relative calm over the past 12 months. If we can achieve ~~harmony~~a ceasefire with hexbear, then maybe we could do the same with lemmygrad?
I'd also prefer our users to make their own choices with regard to instance blocking of leftist sites in particular.
Obviously there will be some folks here that will hate this idea, and some who think it is worth a try and/or would like to make their own choices with regards to blocking. All I will ask is that you go have a look at lemmygrad.ml before you vote, and ask yourself if there is anything posted there you think warrants keeping them defederated?
Because this might be a divisive topic, I'm setting the threshold for this proposal succeeding at >66.6% majority rather than the default >50% so that there is a clear mandate.
The proposal is as follows:
That dbzer0 removes lemmygrad.ml from our blocked instances list for a 1-month trial period. Another vote will then be conducted to either federate permanently or to reinstate the instance block.
Notes
- AFAIK none of our admins have discussed this with lemmygrad prior to this post, so we don't know how they will respond, even if this vote succeeds. But having just checked, we are not currently blocked from their end, so in theory re-federating will be a straightforward process (at least technically).
- We really don't want to cause a big rift in our instance over this, so please there is really no need to get into heated arguments (I mean, what are the chances? Lol). Your vote is what counts most and we will commit to be guided by the voting outcome.
- If this vote succeeds we will reach out to their admins to see if we can come to some mutual agreement about reintegrating our communities while hopefully keeping conflict to a minimum. Having said that, some conflict is probably inevitable ngl. But I think we will be able to ride it out ok.
- I've covered a lot of concerns and talked about conflict a lot, so I'll just add that the big positive of re-federating is that there will be a ton of new users and content to interact with, which will hopefully add to the Lemmy experience for our users if the proposal is voted in.
expiry: 7
Can a north Korean speak out about government abuse? What about a south Korean? We both know the answers to that.
A classic tankie tactic is to talk about their atrocities as if there was no other choice. Fuck that noise. But you cought my spelling error while I'm on mobile so I guess you win this round! Fucking classic tankie! This is a small example of bad faith arguments I don't enjoy spending much time on tbh. Can you say a single thing bad about China or North Korea? Just 1 maybe 2 if you're hardcore? I generally spend more time talking about the problems of the west but the fact that tankies see no evil just makes me look at you the same as a dogmatic MAGA and I don't want that on my feed either.
The west and east is responsible for a more atrocities than I can remember off the top of my head, but guess what it's generally authoritarians doing everything than can to increase their domination. I opose authoritarianism. I understand the world is not going to reflect my beliefs any time soon.
China has brought so many out of poverty while investing in renewable energy and truly opensouce Ai I see that as good and it gives me hope. That doesn't mean I'm not going to say I don't smell shit when there's shit on my face.
Do you understand the definition of chauvinism? I spend more time calling out western authoritarianism than eastern, and I see most western anarchists do the same.
Here's a nifty shorthand to get into the correct campist mindframe: When the people in any region of the world go against the interests of Russia, China or their close allies, it's a "color revolution". When they go against the interests of USA or Europe or their close allies, it's "self determination".
Pretty ridiculous thing to say when there's concrete evidence that almost all the major events that commonly get called color revolutions had US or other Western involvement behind them. Euromaidan, Guaido, the various movements in Georgia, the Hong Kong protests, and so on.
The exception are the more recent ones like the more recent events in Georgia and Bangladesh. I heard some people call the recent Serbian and Turkish protests a color revolution because of how incompetent they were, but I don't think there's really much reason to think they were sponsored by the US.
It would help your case if you could say when the anti-authoritarian, pro-freedom protests in countries associated with US enemy states haven't been color revolutions, or when the US enemy states have sponsored similar things in Western countries.
Not gonna debate your conspiracy theories, mate.
I don't think blindly following the US state department then telling anyone who tries to get you to see reality to go away is a great approach to finding truth. Do you also think the US overthrowing democratically elected leaders in Latin America like Arbenz and Allende is false? Or do you think those are true because they were long enough in the past they don't cause you any cognitive dissonance?
I think you shouldn't conflate your conspiracy theories with facts and I also think you shouldn't sealion quite so much.
You seriously think Arbenz being deposed by a CIA backed coup is just a conspiracy theory? They declassified the documents confirming that they did it
Similarly, US covert intervention in Chile is well-known because of documents that the CIA itself also declassified.
So unless you're suggesting that the CIA is lying to make itself look bad, I think you're the one with poor epistemology and your process for finding truth is just contradicting everything the people you don't like say. Ironic, because if you at least applied that to the US State Department, at least you'd be right every now and then.
I think you should improve your reading comprehension and reiterate that nobody likes a sealion, nevermind one with bad reading comprehension
You said I'm conflating my conspiracy theories with facts. I am providing factual evidence for my "conspiracy theories." What part of that is poor reading comprehension? Because all the other instances of US meddling in foreign affairs I mentioned in my first comment also are backed by factual evidence.
I already stated in my first comment that I'm skeptical that the movements from the last couple years in Serbia, Turkey, and Bangladesh were color revolutions. Maybe they were, but I haven't seen concrete evidence beyond my knowledge of Radio Free Asia, Radio Free Europe, and Voice of America being active in those regions.
Begone, sealion!
Disengage.
Well, considering that NATO is always revealed to have a hand in instigating colour revolutions in its designated enemy countries, which tend to be aligned closer with Russia or the PRC, and that the uprisings that go against the interests of NATO are anti-colonial, that is a fair assessment by the 'campists'.
Meanwhile, you are telling on yourself with the both-sidesing between colonialism and anti-colonial movements (which is overwhelmingly likely solely informed by the 'Iraq has WMDs!' style of propaganda).